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  • Mark 7:20 am on February 13, 2009 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: , , larry burkett, seminary, tallskinnykiwi   

    Church Planting in the Economic Downturn 

    debt money tree

    Yes – going through seminary was a blessing and continues to keep my head up in a hard mission field.

    Yes – seminary is a financial chain around my neck.

    Both statements are true.

    I know others in my seminary who have taken mega-church preaching positions for the sake of paying off debt (some are making near 100,000K a year!).  Some say that this puts the pastor in an unhealthy position of being “the mouthpiece of the rich” and unable to prophetically speak against greed, etc, since he too is under the weight of debt.

    At a church level, we’re seeing new church plants cost somewhere in the upper reaches of a million dollars per plant in the first 3 years!  Is that really something that can “catch fire” or “catalyze a movement” in these economic times?  Other established churches are building huge additions to their meeting space to accommodate their audience.  Right now, many of those construction projects have stopped – in limbo while the recession has its grip on the nation’s pocketbook.    Many other churches live in a state similar to the banks that recently tanked – with debts far outweighing their assets, especially since churches are non-profit organizations.  Many churches just live in a constant state of debt, teetering on the brink of disaster, and regularly hold “Commitment Sundays” to avoid catastrophe or to fund the next project.

    This was more feasible to do when times were “good.”  When construction was booming, when stocks were booming.  Right now, the Church has to decide what is most important – it has to step up and live differently from the rest of the world.  No organization will bail out indebted churches – only Christ can.

    To those churches that operate debt-free: Thank You!  Teach the rest of us!  For those that don’t – this is not a slam against you – God loves you and is pretty good at paying debts (money and sin), but we can’t expect him to “bless our work” if we’re plowing deeper and deeper into bondage with the God of Mammon.

    1-darling-debt

    TallSkinnyKiwi, a prolific blogger on all things emergent and organic, has written a fantastic piece on the current shape of church planting as it relates to financial sustainability.

    I agree with TallSkinnyKiwi:

    One of the reasons I believe the simple, organic/house/emerging church movement is continually gaining ground and in some countries, blossoming beyond expectations, is because it is sustainable and reproducible, just as the early church was.

    Yes – we’re reaching lots of people with huge church plants.

    Yes – the burden of a church campus is a huge financial chain around a church’s neck.

    Both statements are true.

    Part 1: Church Planting in the Economic Downturn

    Part 2: The CEO that bails ME out

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    • miller 8:32 am on February 14, 2009 Permalink

      mark,

      good thoughts.

      one question, you say “we’re reaching lots of people with huge church plants.”

      really? ’cause my impression is that these churches grow largely through immigration from other churches.

      i wonder how things are going for Joel Osteen and his “best life now” church.

      good post,
      peace

    • Mark 8:36 am on February 14, 2009 Permalink

      i think you’re right – most mega-churches pull in transfer christians. but a lot of new, launch-day style church plants do baptize/convert lots of new Christians. I think they do a good job of “getting them in the door” of their faith, but like we heard from Willow Creek, are struggling with how to disciple them. Thoughts?

    • Daniel 8:44 am on February 16, 2009 Permalink

      When did we all decide to believe that debt=happiness/prosperity/advancement/necessity/prudence? Lies! The fruit of the Spirit is, among other things, patience and self-control. Piling on debt to get everything we want RIGHT NOW! or ASAP! seems to be the opposite of godliness.

    • Mark 8:50 am on February 16, 2009 Permalink

      danx, if only you had written that comment on this blog 8 years ago, before i took on tons of debt myself…of course, it would’a been pretty sweet watching you write a comment on a blog that wouldn’t be created for years to come…*du du du du* twilight zone…

  • Mark 9:58 am on September 30, 2008 Permalink | Reply  

    The Great Moderation 

    If you’re like me, you’ve been watching the news and stocks as we witness history in the making.  Yesterday, after the House defeated the bailout plan from the Senate, the DOW Jones Industrial Average fell 777 points, the largest one day fall in its history.  Economically speaking, we are in the middle of a major turning point in our country, and our world.  The days of unfettered spending and reckless, limitless greed are numbered.

    The national debt hangs at about 9.3 TRILLION dollars.  I’m no economic expert, but even I understand that’s a big, hairy problem.  I can’t even type that number out on a normal calculator!  US families aren’t much better; and now that teens can hold credit cards in their name, they are graduating HIGH SCHOOL with an average of $6,000 dollars in debt.  What a way to start a life!

    Trina and I left college in debt.  School loans were sold to us like a bottle of snake oil.  Trina talks about how signing her name on that first “financial aid” package was a major negative turning point in her relationship with God.  What sounded like “aid” before our college days now sounds more like “bondage” and “debt.”

    Around the time I graduated in May, we had some friends point us to Dave Ramsey’s Financial Peace University.  We listened to all the sessions during our long move from Texas to Chicago, although we had begun to learn some of the principles while in Abilene.

    Ramsey describes his plan as, “Giving you the same financial advice your grandmother would, (only we keep our teeth in).”  His main goal – help people live within their means, and climb out of debt.  Through sort of a baby step process, he gives couples, churches, and businesses steps out of the insanity of credit, mortgages, car leases, and much of the monstrosity that comes from living on the thin wire of excessive debt.  He was against the $700 billion dollar bail-out, and after hearing from both sides of the issue, I side with Ramsey.  The market will course correct – we are not headed for the Great Depression Part 2.  The Government in the ’30′s developed the FDIC to secure banking deposits – there is more regulation over private banks (and doubtless there will be more in the near future because of this mess).

    What is more likely to happen is that banks will not be able to sell 30 year no-money-down mortgages for families looking to buy a mansion they can’t afford.  Along with that, it will be tougher for people to be approved for credit cards or car leases that they have no business applying for in the first place.  Businesses and banks will have to reel in their liquidity rates that resemble some sense of sanity, while other banks and institutions will undoubtedly continue to fail, the wise will survive.

    We are not moving into the Great Depression, we are entering “The Great Moderation.“  This is the time when Cash is King – pull out some envelopes and follow a budget.  Save money, don’t spend it.  Live simply, give generously.  This is a time when the whole nation may begin to heal from its drunken hubris.  Followers of Christ can learn much from their earliest brothers and sisters – “who shared their possessions, and had everything in common, and not a needy person could be found among them.” (Acts 2)

    This is not the end of Capitalism, but in this age we must think about a Creative Capitalism that doesn’t only reward a few and neglect millions more.  Do what V-8 Juice is doing, giving away fresh produce to the working poor with some of the profits they make on their nutrition drinks.  Or do what Ethos Water does, putting many of their proceeds on bottled water toward water-well development in Africa.  Or do what the first century Christians did, in sharing a common purse.  Health insurance would be a lot simpler if you were paying into a pot shared by others who actually care about you and worship Christ with you on Sundays.

    We as a nation are learning from our mistakes – many of them were lessons already learned during the ’30′s – we can not live beyond what God has given us.

    …Give us TODAY our DAILY bread.

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    • Vanessa 10:11 am on October 1, 2008 Permalink

      Great thoughts. I agree; this needs to be our wake-up call. And even though I hate being in debt because of student loans, I am thankful that they gave me an education that does not depreciate in value. Still, the thought of paying them off for the next 15-20 years is a bit daunting.

    • Mark 3:22 pm on October 1, 2008 Permalink

      Vanessa,

      Good point – our education is an investment that “doesn’t depreciate.” Or at least – the education doesn’t – my mind however is sort of…forgetful… :)

      Kat and I downloaded some debt elimination software that helps us get a “debt snowball” rolling – our dream is to be debt free in 3 1/2 years. It’s kinda scary, and it means hard work and part time jobs for us now – but it’ll be worth it for us down the road!

    • Vanessa 9:14 am on October 7, 2008 Permalink

      What a great dream. I think we need some ideas like that. We have a lot of debt, just from school, nothing else. But the school debt is great enough to overwhelm me! I’d like to get it all paid off in 10 years, but that is a lofty goal considering what we owe.

  • Katrina 7:01 pm on June 29, 2008 Permalink | Reply
    Tags: Painting   

    On Comparison 

    Photobucket
    We should find people of great influence in our peer group and in our discipline and listen to them. Because they differ slightly from us, these people sharpen us. Sometimes they are achieving such greatness that we feel a drip of depression looming in our seeming lack of accomplishment. But that only remains when we focus on our accomplishments or lack thereof.

    Many would call this sort of activity “self-centered.” I contend that it is probably not “self-centered” enough. Perhaps we need to go even deeper into searching ourselves – we need to search inside of ourselves to find the still small voice instructing us. This voice trumps all external, peer-reviewed comparison. It says, “Keep running the race” and “fight the good fight” and “I will give you rest.” Man, I love that still small voice.

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